V8 Playtest April 20th

Discussion/Information about the Duchy of Siar Geata

Moderators: Scorch Flamedancer, LucasTheLost, Scoot

V8 Playtest April 20th

Postby dieterbron » Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:57 pm

We will be play testing V8 rules this Saturday. In order to get everyone used to the rules, we will be playing first level only. The rules PDF for the most current rule revision can be found here: https://www.warlordsports.com/Assets/Gallery/MF_97_9_1.pdf Or at least, this is the version we will be playing. Look the Part will be determined both by wearing complete garb (Pants and shirt) no t-shirts, Jeans etc..."medieval" period garb only please, and having a class sash. Yes, i know I have to wear my actual shirt and not my sweat wicking one. Any questions can be posted in reply.
Ich gebe nicht einen Fluch!
Herr Dieter Bron Von Boneschvinger
User avatar
dieterbron
 
Posts: 463
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2007 6:59 pm
Location: San Diego

Re: V8 Playtest April 20th

Postby Randy » Sat Apr 20, 2013 11:15 am

I will be there !
User avatar
Randy
 
Posts: 1583
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2007 6:16 pm
Location: Silver Sun

Re: V8 Playtest April 20th

Postby dieterbron » Tue Apr 23, 2013 11:25 am

eRandy, It was great having you there. A lot of people were very happy to have you with us, and every one said they found you incredibly helpful.

On another note, any "issues" found with the V8 rules should be commented on here:

One issue I found was the marked lack of offensive magic at 1st level. It was so limited that no one wanted to play a first level spell caster. While I understand that V8 is supposed to be played at the current level of the players, many players expressed that they wouldn't want to start playing a spell caster if first level is so impotent.

Archers, wow, WAY too strong at first level. A destruction arrow, and Poison arrow at first level make them one of the most threatening players on the field.

Berserk....add shield breaking.
Ich gebe nicht einen Fluch!
Herr Dieter Bron Von Boneschvinger
User avatar
dieterbron
 
Posts: 463
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2007 6:59 pm
Location: San Diego

Re: V8 Playtest April 20th

Postby Scorch Flamedancer » Tue Apr 23, 2013 5:18 pm

One of my major concerns were the rougher shield play. Not that I have anything against it, but that they defined it the way they did concerns me. As it was demonstrated at the park, a larger player like Dieter shield pushing someone of equal size's shield, like Thomas, is no problem. Thomas is not going anywhere. But if he was to go against say me with that same average force, he's gonna knock me on my ass. The shield play rules need to be changed to either just straight Bel shield rules, or revert back to V7.0. This the way it is now lends too much chance to fouls being called, or worse injury.
My body is my sword, my mind is my blade. Without them, I would be nothing.
User avatar
Scorch Flamedancer
 
Posts: 214
Joined: Wed Aug 08, 2012 9:58 pm
Location: Siar Geata, Carlsbad

Re: V8 Playtest April 20th

Postby Randy » Wed Apr 24, 2013 7:12 am

Karissa D'ann wrote:One of my major concerns were the rougher shield play. Not that I have anything against it, but that they defined it the way they did concerns me. As it was demonstrated at the park, a larger player like Dieter shield pushing someone of equal size's shield, like Thomas, is no problem. Thomas is not going anywhere. But if he was to go against say me with that same average force, he's gonna knock me on my ass. The shield play rules need to be changed to either just straight Bel shield rules, or revert back to V7.0. This the way it is now lends too much chance to fouls being called, or worse injury.


If he moves you, he bashing, not being aggressive. He can move your equipment, not you
User avatar
Randy
 
Posts: 1583
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2007 6:16 pm
Location: Silver Sun

Re: V8 Playtest April 20th

Postby Hannoske » Wed Apr 24, 2013 8:50 am

The intent of the current V8 shield rules is to clearly articulate how a large group of Amtgarders currently play. Nothing in the V7 rules prevents me from intentionially having my shield make contact with your shield or equipment. It does prevent me from bashing you. A shield bash to many people is defined as hitting a person with your shield, or striking their equipment with enough force to move them. Both of these things are still prohibited in V8.
Emphasis mine.
V8 wrote:Allowed
The following actions are acceptable
1. Weapon to Weapon contact is allowed.
2. Weapon to body contact is allowed on valid Hit Locations using Strike-Legal portions.
3. Body to Weapon contact: Weapons may be pushed, swept, and otherwise manipulated with
your body so long as the Weapon is not trapped or grabbed.
a. Pushing or sweeping a Strike-Legal surface results in a valid hit to the location used for
contact.
4. Weapon to Shield contact is allowed.
5. Shield to Weapon contact: Shields may be used to deflect, move or pin an opponents Weapon
6. Shield to Shield contact: Shields may be used to deflect, turn, or pin an opponents Shield so
long as the wielder of the struck Shield is not moved. Bashing a shield is prohibited.
Disallowed
The following actions are unacceptable. Some amount of incidental contact is expected in a contact
sport but repeated or egregious offenses will result in suspension.
1. Body to body contact is prohibited.
2. Body to Shield contact is prohibited.
3. Active Shield to body contact is prohibited: Passively using a Shield to prevent an opponents
forward movement is acceptable and does not count as body to Shield contact on the part of the
recipient.
4. Active Weapon to body contact using portions of a Weapon other than Strike-Legal is
prohibited: Passively planting the shaft of a Great Weapon to block an incoming opponent is
acceptable.
5. Forcing a players Weapons against them with your body or Shield is prohibited.


V7 wrote:14. Grappling with an opponent, shield bashing, rough, dangerous, or offensive physical contact is strictly
prohibited and can result in being banned from play indefinitely.
Hannoske
 
Posts: 466
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 8:29 pm
Location: Thor's Refuge

Re: V8 Playtest April 20th

Postby Scorch Flamedancer » Wed Apr 24, 2013 7:49 pm

I realize moving a body with shield to shield or shield to body contact is not allowed. But I'm telling you that since people are different sizes and weight, people will move under an unintentional bashing-like blow. Its going to happen.So my suggestion was to change the rules to allow light movement of another player (a step, maybe two) or revert back to the old rule set for shields.
My body is my sword, my mind is my blade. Without them, I would be nothing.
User avatar
Scorch Flamedancer
 
Posts: 214
Joined: Wed Aug 08, 2012 9:58 pm
Location: Siar Geata, Carlsbad

Re: V8 Playtest April 20th

Postby Hannoske » Thu Apr 25, 2013 5:30 am

I appologize, I wasn't clear. The V8 rules are identical to the V7 rules in implimentation. The only difference is that V8 more clearly identifies what is allowed vice leaving it to the vague "no shield bashing".

Some people around Amtgard have chosen to interpret the V7 rules as meaning no shield contact, even though that verbiage is not there. The whole purpose of that section in V8 is to remove this "false" interpretation.
Hannoske
 
Posts: 466
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 8:29 pm
Location: Thor's Refuge

Re: V8 Playtest April 20th

Postby Scorch Flamedancer » Thu Apr 25, 2013 12:50 pm

I see, interesting
My body is my sword, my mind is my blade. Without them, I would be nothing.
User avatar
Scorch Flamedancer
 
Posts: 214
Joined: Wed Aug 08, 2012 9:58 pm
Location: Siar Geata, Carlsbad

Re: V8 Playtest April 20th

Postby Hannoske » Thu Apr 25, 2013 1:10 pm

I would like to clarify, I was not present in your demonstration, so I am not saying what was shown you was correct/incorrect. Rubbing, contact, and maneuvering are all acceptable. Using your shield to knock the edge of someone else's to open a shot is also acceptable, but once you use your hips, shoulders of forward motion to strike/move your opponent's equipment, you are entering bash territory, and this should not be accepted. Randy should be able to show you more specifically some of the things I am talking about, as well as explain where some disagreements lay with each interpretation.
Hannoske
 
Posts: 466
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 8:29 pm
Location: Thor's Refuge

Re: V8 Playtest April 20th

Postby Scorch Flamedancer » Mon Apr 29, 2013 12:41 pm

I'm just concerned with bigger players going against smaller players trying to use rough shield play (not bashing) and then someone is moved accidentally merely due to size and someone is declared dead or in trouble for just being larger, the smaller player only taking a step or two backwards because he isn't as strong.
My body is my sword, my mind is my blade. Without them, I would be nothing.
User avatar
Scorch Flamedancer
 
Posts: 214
Joined: Wed Aug 08, 2012 9:58 pm
Location: Siar Geata, Carlsbad

Re: V8 Playtest April 20th

Postby Randy » Mon Apr 29, 2013 5:17 pm

Karissa D'ann wrote:I'm just concerned with bigger players going against smaller players trying to use rough shield play (not bashing) and then someone is moved accidentally merely due to size and someone is declared dead or in trouble for just being larger, the smaller player only taking a step or two backwards because he isn't as strong.


Being intimidated by a larger player is a valid concern. Amtgard is in the middle ground when it comes to personal space. Some larps require a specific distance be kept between each combatant while others allow full on charges. The gray area we have created by this rule is a point of concern for lots of people. At the end of the day, it will come down to each park trying to enforce the standard as evenly as possible. The intent has always been that aggressive shield work be allowed, just as hannoske said the hope with v8 is that it will be much more clear what is/isn't aggressive shield work.

Here is the official contact information for the committee. Let them know your experience level, park size, and number of times playing so they are able to understand how the v8 changes are affecting players across the game:

"Regarding V8: Please send us your feedback. This isn't some grand conspiracy to steal your game or break Amtgard. If you don't tell us why our ideas blow we can't fix them."
AmtgardV8@gmail.com

Here is the link to the esam discussion:

http://www.electricsamurai.com/forums/v ... 14&start=0
User avatar
Randy
 
Posts: 1583
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2007 6:16 pm
Location: Silver Sun

Re: V8 Playtest April 20th

Postby Nico [xD] » Tue Apr 30, 2013 12:46 pm

Woah, v8 testing from you guys?

Wish I was still in town. I've been wanting to test v8 for ages.
Disregard whatever i just said.

Nico, bunny enthusiast of the Barony of Siar Geata.
User avatar
Nico [xD]
 
Posts: 495
Joined: Thu May 22, 2008 9:43 pm
Location: SG

Re: V8 Playtest April 20th

Postby Rose » Wed Jul 10, 2013 2:21 pm

Conspiracy, no. Its just a small group of people deciding the game has to change with out taking a vote from the majority on if they want to completely change the game first. I mean really when you get down to it, that's why people are upset. They were never asked if they wanted the game they dedicate a large part of their life to changed, so why should they believe any thoughts feelings or concerns will be listened to? Actions speak louder than words and the actions so far put forth are go with us or get out.
Far dearer the grave or the prision illumed by one patriot name,
then the trophies of all who have risen on liberty's ruin to fame!
(Forget no the field, Thomas Moore)
User avatar
Rose
 
Posts: 180
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2007 2:37 am

Re: V8 Playtest April 20th

Postby Etah » Wed Jul 10, 2013 4:09 pm

Rose wrote:Conspiracy, no. Its just a small group of people deciding the game has to change with out taking a vote from the majority on if they want to completely change the game first. I mean really when you get down to it, that's why people are upset. They were never asked if they wanted the game they dedicate a large part of their life to changed, so why should they believe any thoughts feelings or concerns will be listened to? Actions speak louder than words and the actions so far put forth are go with us or get out.


Before V8, our game has changed every year. I started on V7.5 which quickly became V7.6 and then V7.7. The only reason we don't have V7.8 and V7.9 is because they stopped yearly modifications to the rules in anticipation of V8. V7 is a broken rules set and needed a complete overhaul. I have personally never had more fun in battle games than I do right now. V8 is fun. Go into it with an open mind.
~Baronet Squire Etah Landshark
Corsair
Shire of Aegir's Hall

"Hate is a strong word, but I found out if you say it backwards what appears is a bald nerd." - MC Nameloc
User avatar
Etah
 
Posts: 999
Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:25 pm
Location: In the Halls of Aegir

Next

Return to Duchy of Siar Geata - Oceanside, CA

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 8 guests

cron